JFJ Forums

Hope this title catches some attention. I have a thread in the theology section discussing my perplexity over my eternal destination. I am so thoroughly convinced by the scriptures , especially by Y'shua's own words that there is a hot bed of coals for eterity awaiting for me after this life even though I have placed my trust in him and given my life to him. I am a gentile beleiver in Y'shua, though I am not affiliated with a Messianic Congregation. Christ, the Messiah paid a debt we could not pay. Then the New Testament writers pull out their Santa Claus bag full of randam snares, traps, and pitfalls so that the free gift of salvation would seem to be guaranteed to be lost. The New Testament is so thorough in its warnings of judgment, hellfire, and possible ways to not be forgiven while at the same time ironically seem to be contradicting itself and saying salvation is assured.

The only one who will answer my post is a member who even burdens my growing works theology (which I acknowledge to be dangerous) by commanding a rigid Torah observance neccessary to salvation - I would like more input, especially from Jews about this. Acts 15 and Romans 3:28-4+, as well as other scriptures seem to say to me that works of the law cannot justify anyone.



My 2nd and 3rd posts are probably the most logically written and most important in that thread. In my 2nd and 3rd posts I

.

First you trash me in every thread and then make claims about me that I never said - and then you want an honest discussion???  You are a very dishonest and deceptive person and I know what you are up to.

I have answers for you but your trashing of me shows you do not really want to know the truth.  I believe you are here to cause problems because I have posted the truth - every post you make false claims about what I have said as a way of trashing me and then cry because nobody will give you the answers you claim you want.

What part of Torah do you disagree with? - start with that and leave out the trashing of me because I posted against your beloved pagan feast days.  Maybe you disagree with the part about loving G-d? or maybe disagree with the part about not making idols?  or maybe you want to murder people?  mainstream "christians" tend to have two disagreements with Torah - keeping G-d's dietary laws and keeping Shabbat ---- both which Adonai REPEATEDLY said are very important to Him and both were reaffirmed by Yeshua and His disciples.

Since when is obeying G-d considered a "work" ???  I obey G-d because I love Him and want to please Him.  If you consider that a work, then you have no love for Him.

Mat 5:17  Do not think that I came to annul the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to annul, but to fulfill.
Mat 5:18  Truly I say to you, Until the heaven and the earth pass away, in no way shall one iota or one point pass away from the Law until all comes to pass.
Mat 5:19  Therefore, whoever relaxes one of these commandments, the least, and shall teach men so, he shall be called least in the kingdom of Heaven. But whoever does and teaches them, this one shall be called great in the kingdom of Heaven.

* * * * * * *

Mat 7:13  Go in through the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and many are the ones entering in through it.
Mat 7:14  For narrow is the gate, and constricted is the way that leads away into life, and few are the ones finding it.
Mat 7:15  But beware of the false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inside they are plundering wolves.

* * * * * * *

Mat 7:21  Not everyone who says to Me, Lord, Lord, will enter into the kingdom of Heaven, but the ones who do the will of My Father in Heaven.
Mat 7:22  Many will say to Me in that day, Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name do many works of power?
Mat 7:23  And then I will declare to them, I never knew you; "depart from Me, those working lawlessness! (ie: did not follow Adonai)

.

I have input as a gentile brother. I take it from the book of Colossians.
I consider the New Testament as an invitation to Jews first and also to the Gentile. (capital J and G) It is apparent the majority of Pauls writings were sympathetic to those who were excluded from the commonwealth of Israel by returning to the law as their justification. There were those who considered Jesus a scorcerer a criminal and one who had come to destroy the laws (lower case l) of Moses. This was not so. Jesus came to fulfill the law in that He paid the price for our breaking of it. The only begotten perfect without sin Son of God, the Lamb of God whoes blood was shed. This was the continual sacrifice which can no more be offered. There is no loopholes in the New Testament for unholy behaviour . This would only
serve to bring us closer to Jesus and the sacrifice He made for our unholiness.  Jesus is the way the truth and the life- the way to God is technically God and technically Jesus and technically the Holy Spirit.
Keeping of the law never saved anyone........ Now.......I will finish this post with the scripture from Colossians prefaced with the words of Jesus.

John 7:19  Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law?

Colossians 1:12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us deserving to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of His dear Son.
14 In whom we have redemption through his blood even the forgiveness  
of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him and for Him.
17 And He is before all things, and by Him all things consist.
18 And He is head of the Body the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead: that in all things He might have the preeminence.
19 For it pleased the Father that in Him all fulness should dwell;
20 And, having made peace through the blood of His cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by Him I say whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
21 And you, that were sometimes alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath He reconciled.
22 In the body of His flesh through death to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in His sight:
23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven: whereof I Paul am made a minister.

I cannot add to the perfect gift of Jesus atoning sacrifice of which God is well pleased. I can only pray in hope in believing the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
I cannot take away from what He did by breaking the law- I can only say My Father which art in heaven hallowed be thy name- thy kingdom come- thy will be done - in earth as it is in heaven- give us this day our daily bread- and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us- and lead us not into temptation -but deliver us from evil- for thine is the kingdom the power and the glory- forever and ever - Amen

and to close with the words of Jesus:
John 14 :2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.  

I would certainly like more input into this promise of eternal life too esp.   from my Jewish Christian Christian Jewish believers in Y'shua.

The best advice I would hold onto would be from Jesus himself:

39One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"

40But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? 41We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."

42Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

43Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

This man had committed enough sin to be condemned to crucifixion, and yet Jesus assured him that he would be with Him in paradise. Paul ordered the Jewish believers to be stoned and murdered, yet he looked forward to heaven...as he says through all of his letters. This should give us confidence.

Please don't misinterpret what I am about to say.

If there were no heaven, no eternal life, the christian way of life on this earth  would still be the greatest, simply for the fact we all would treat one another with genuine love and respect.

John 14 speaks of the many "forevers" Christ Jesus has promised and prepared for those who love Him.

John 17:[3] And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

Matthew 7

13 "Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.

14 "For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

Few will find it, not most , not even half, only a few.  This is taught all through scripture only a remnant is ever saved not a vast majority.

This is a serious thing and it needs to be taken seriously.  

Father, Son, Holy Spirit these have always been, are , and yes 4-ever will be. The three are one.

We are created  in the Image of G-d the Father, by G-d, designed to live forever by His Holy Spirit. We are forgiven by the shed blood of Jesus Christ the son of G-d the Father. Jesus ever lives to make intercession for us.

John 17:[3] And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other NAME, given among men whereby we might be saved.

Davar,

That is part of the beauty of being a Christian , working out one's own salvation (with the Holy Ghost of course). Isn't it great to know, There is one lawgiver who is able to save or destroy? It is something to know that Y'shua the  Son loves us, died for us, and provided the way to the Father.
You seem to know the gospel also quoting the New Testament and have somewhat of a grasp of salvation. I will leave this thread with one final thought, the gospel (evangelion) is "Good News" not "Good views".

            Much peace I pray for you and your family.

The Gospel is Good news to those who accept His redemption as well as those who Love Him, but bad news and eternal death to those who don't accept him  and don't Love Him.

Ebionites! I can only shake my head and walk away!

Every action there is an equal reaction so the reason why Lord Yashua was sent is to save  for those who believe only in HIM not for those who dont... Well maybe they have their own special redemption plan...Let us see when we all die. See you in the last days...

Shalom!