willby trying to connect a literal udnerstanding of baptism saves to the law is not a very good or honest at all.
Sense Paul says no one will be justifiy before God by The law or no one shall be saved By the law its not very good of trying to connect The NT to something we are no longer saved by.
To delay someone from being baptized after they believe is wrong and it further shows a lack of understanding for what baptism does for you.
tell that To The first century church.
willby do you understand that the doctrine baptism saves came from The dark/middle ages?
Here the Word
Believe in the Word is to act on the Word
Baptism into Jesus remits the curse - puts you in the N.T. covenant - circumcision of heart
Filled with the Holy Ghost.
Live righteous
Communion is for our mistakes - communion also remits sin - His blood
couple of notes i agree believeing is taking action but it clear The one that is taken action is the holy spirit to salvation not anything base on what we do.
circumcision of heart I am yet to see any scripture proving this or at least saying this in a literal sense.
Filled with the Holy Ghost. The holy spirit indwells in one as soon as they Believe confessing it with there mouth.
The holy spirit comes over the person from baptism of the holy spirit not water baptism two different baptism and two different meanings.
Since The earlier CHurch view baptism does not and the apostles base believeing that saves and its the holy ghost that takes action for our salvation I will view it the same.
baptism saves was a false gospel that spring out not from first century church but by The catholic church in the dark ages.
Quote:
"What does Baptism in Jesus name do for us?
1/ Removes the curse
2/ Gives us a new name
3/ We receive the Holy Ghost
4/ We are new creatures in Christ
5/ Circumcision of Heart
6/ Joint Heirs with Christ
7/ We are the true Church
8/ Our name is written in the Book of Life
9/ We are higher than the angels
10/ We are the body of Christ - He is the Head
11/ We are sons of God
12/ We can do all things in Christ Jesus
13/ We are in the High Calling in Christ- High Priest after the Order of Melchisedec "
RE:
I guess all the Catholics that get baptized at birth have nothing to fear then.
As soon as they get baptized in Jesus name they are on the path to G-d hence no need to worry anymore.
Let's get saved you people. Get baptized in Jesus name and then murder, lie, betray, steel, indulge, etc etc... do everything you like - You are already saved.
Of course I'm just being sarcastic. To me this thread it's pretty pointless.
If the point was to teach about salvation in Jesus name... you're far from the truth.
Surgarman
I am not directing my post to you anymore so please stop responding to them.
You are not teachable.
Understand this for once please. I teach and I believe in the Doctrine of Christ and The Faith ONLY.
I teach what was taught before man contaminated the truth.
I teach from the bible.
I don't care what any man or church has done -- it means nothing to me nor can it add to me.
If all you had were the scriptures you would be less confused and this would apply to many people trapped in a belief system other then the Doctrine of Christ.
Please stop all your posts--they interfer with me trying to connect with people that may be searching for truth according to scripture.
I started this post for a reason so please stop interfering, enough is enough.
Surgarman
I am not directing my post to you anymore so please stop responding to them.
You are not teachable.
Understand this for once please. I teach and I believe in the Doctrine of Christ and The Faith ONLY.
I teach what was taught before man contaminated the truth.
I teach from the bible.
I don't care what any man or church has done -- it means nothing to me nor can it add to me.
If all you had were the scriptures you would be less confused and this would apply to many people trapped in a belief system other then the Doctrine of Christ.
Please stop all your posts--they interfer with me trying to connect with people that may be searching for truth according to scripture.
I started this post for a reason so please stop interfering, enough is enough.
wilby Your the one who is not teachable.
You have another gospel base on what we do one gets salvation.
f all you had were the scriptures you would be less confused and this would apply to many people trapped in a belief system other then the Doctrine of Christ.
Nothing that we do NOTHING we can not do anything to get salvation.
I have the scripture and they hold true.
The apostles ask do they bellieve in Jesus and if yes then they were saved buy God spirit alone nothing man can do.
The apostles do a fine job at showing baptism does not save for they even they self separate believe and baptism in the Holy bible.
Believing is the only part we play because we have to confess with our own mouth and when we do The holy spirit finish the rest.
pretty much wilby no scripture supports you nor do you even know how to put it in the correct grammar of understand.
it pretty simple The apostle will answer believe onto Jesus and you will be saved. When a person does baptism is it because to show he now is being literal saved puting in the body of Christ Now or when he answer the apostle I do Believe?
Like I said before salvation is something only God can bring us The holy spirit is what SEALS US with God when we believe 1 eph 1:13 and water baptism is the symbol of one Confessing and the work of the holy spirit
Surgarman
I am not directing my post to you anymore so please stop responding to them.
You are not teachable.
Understand this for once please. I teach and I believe in the Doctrine of Christ and The Faith ONLY.
I teach what was taught before man contaminated the truth.
I teach from the bible.
I don't care what any man or church has done -- it means nothing to me nor can it add to me.
If all you had were the scriptures you would be less confused and this would apply to many people trapped in a belief system other then the Doctrine of Christ.
Please stop all your posts--they interfer with me trying to connect with people that may be searching for truth according to scripture.
I started this post for a reason so please stop interfering, enough is enough.
willby I do not care if your post are to me or not.
you should read the rules when you sign .
this forum is an open forum to everyone.
Wilby,
Well well well,
I didn't expact so much hatred from Jews for Jesus,,,
about Lying, not discussing just... blaming... seems you go according to your forefathers footsteps from the Churches??? Well I shouldn't write such things on discussionforum...
But it seems that it is not so true that every Jew can argue on this website? Or is it just you...
It's very true that Moses wrote and song that the Jews where bought by HaShem... That's very scripticall... So do you want to blame HaShem for saying that? or Moses for writing and singing that???
And than you are standing in the seat of HaShem to say to me that I'm not saved???? Who are you, to say that? Somebody more important than Moses?
I never had on other forums that somebody wrote so aggrasively, within my tekst, but o.k. maybe you are a fanatic. and maybe you will not save me in a next crusade or holocaust... of course it's your choice to be the judge...
I wrote still quite positivly I think, and according to Jewish rules, new believers should be baptised... nothing wrong... (only maybe that the church started to do their interpretation of it).
Well because of the baptism issue more Jews where killed than saved by the Messiancs I think, but I'm still trying... and I'm still smiling (sometimes)...
My father came in a Protestant Church during the war to get some food via family... But no, every ChristianJew had to leave by ChurchLaw to the camps... and the members of the Evangelicall German Christians had to be member of the NSDAP...
Well how scripticall do you want to be... these where baptised Jews even...
I don't know how old you are... are you Jewish?
Well I hope your knowledge will grow... and that you don't go into your fathers footsteps...
WOW! Another way to be saved! But only for the Jews??
I will add it to my list of how you can not be saved.
Did you every read how the Jewish people came out of favour with God for their disobedience to His Word? You are truely following in your fathers foot steps aren't you?
Surely you must be joking and if your not then you are lost and not saved according to the New Testemant salvation.
The O.T. ended at the resurrection and a new way, a better way, with better promises began.
All scriptural !!
Well I didn't write that there is salvation only for the Jews... I wrote that new believers had to be baptised I agree with that. So maybe I was not clear enough about it. But you misquote me by saying that that there's only salvations for the Jews. Judaism doesn't claim that, o.k. maybe some rabbi out of 2000 rabbi's...
Off course a lot of people where disobedient to HIS word... even Moses was, we never claimed that we are perfect. in the New Testament it mainly looks perfect, but in the background and later there where enough disobedient Christians,,, so what Should I judge them..
against New Testament salvation... So that is a different one??? And overrules HaShems claim that He bought us allready... Is the New Testament against Moses and HaShem, it overrules it... is that what you claim? I don't claim that the Tenach overrules the New Testament... It's just hard to believe for me that 1 messiach overrules all the other mesisachs... besides that I show respect that maybe new believers are saved by baptism....
So according that 1 off your students became 102 year old... I don't believe that you are a teenager. So I don't understand the way how you react so agressively. Or are you an American? I wrote your profile, and it says a lot of I..., I..., I... well never my rabbi's spoke in that sence either...
Still time to grow hopefully in a positive way.
Wilby,
Well well well,
I didn't expact so much hatred from Jews for Jesus,,,
about Lying, not discussing just... blaming... seems you go according to your forefathers footsteps from the Churches??? Well I shouldn't write such things on discussionforum...
But it seems that it is not so true that every Jew can argue on this website? Or is it just you...Don't lie to people about salvation
It's very true that Moses wrote and song that the Jews where bought by HaShem... That's very scripticall... So do you want to blame HaShem for saying that? or Moses for writing and singing that???
O.T. salvation does not apply today--sorry but this is scriptural.
And than you are standing in the seat of HaShem to say to me that I'm not saved???? Who are you, to say that? Somebody more important than Moses?
More important? Moses did what was required of him and he found salvation in his day. I to am trying to save people by water according to scripture therefore I to am important.
Take note: The Jews were only one tribe that went through the waters - there are eleven other tribes that were not Jewish. Abram was a Hebrew so the children of Israel were consider Hebrews/Israelites.
I never had on other forums that somebody wrote so aggrasively,
My agressivness got your attention and time is to short for small talk.
I wrote still quite positivly I think, and according to Jewish rules, new believers should be baptised...
Baptism is from the Doctrine of Christ - not Jewish rules.
Hatred? not at all!
BUT, I have heard many ways to be saved that have nothing to do with the doctrine of Christ. What you are saying about the Jews being bought ....well you were not there so you have no part that matter--you did not go through the waters--then or now.
I get very upset when someone preaches unscriptural salvation that can lead people to their death if not corrected--therefore, I will correct anyone that states this type of a lie--and it is a lie. By the way --you are stating that no Jews need to be baptized just new Gentile converts.
Everyone in the N.T. must go through the waters of baptism to be in the N.T. covenant -- equal to circumcision in the O.T. but even better.
We receive His name, we are in the body of Christ, we are joint with Christ....
at work I was just called away