JFJ Forums - Proof That I'm Patrilineally Jewish

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I realize that I'm not just some gentile sitting back and hearing about Jews and Israel in church. I'm a Jewish woman who has both salvation and judgement first, and these stories about the Jewish people are actually a part of my history.

1) "I'm not just some gentile...." ~ and neither am I. The story of God an Israel is real and true and applicable to all of us re: our humanity. I also know that Israel was the chosen instrument through which God would/did reveal Himself, His righteousness, our sinfulness, and Jesus, "the Jew", who is our Savior. The Nation He "wedded" Himself to. The apple of His eye. His Beloved. As such He has required more from them, and they have suffered on His behalf. And He is not through with Israel.

2) And likewise they are part of my history, even though I am "just some gentile sitting back and hearing...in church", because I am a daughter of Abraham with regards to faith. I am grafted into the Tree. I am reaping the rewards that God told to, and offered to Israel first, through the many prophets, etc, re: Abraham's seed; Jesus.

And Paul said (CJB, Phillipians 3): "3 For it is we who are the Circumcised, we who worship by the Spirit of God and make our boast in the Messiah Yeshua! We do not put confidence in human qualifications,

4 even though I certainly have grounds for putting confidence in such things. If anyone else thinks he has grounds for putting confidence in human qualifications, I have better grounds: 5 b'rit-milah on the eighth day, by birth belonging to the people of Isra'el, from the tribe of Binyamin, a Hebrew-speaker, with Hebrew-speaking parents, in regard to the Torah, a Parush, 6 in regard to zeal, a persecutor of the Messianic Community, in regard to the righteousness demanded by legalism, blameless. 7 But the things that used to be advantages for me, I have, because of the Messiah, come to consider a disadvantage. 8 Not only that, but I consider everything a disadvantage in comparison with the supreme value of knowing the Messiah Yeshua as my Lord. It was because of him that I gave up *everything* [including lineage: all the things in verses 5 & 6] and regard it all as garbage, in order to gain the Messiah"

-emphasis, and bracketed comment, mine-

Sheitl Queen Wrote:

GoyOfY'shua Wrote:

I don't want to be part of your non-Messianic, Hasidic group that shuns patrilineal and Messianic Jews

Good, because you will never be acceptable to us.
By the way, I am not Chassidic.

"Patrilineal Jews" are not Jews, and therefore there is nothing
to shun. Any Messianic Jew who is halachaly Jewish (Jewish
mother) should not be welcome into the Jewish community
until they repent of their sin.

Sheitl, Would this sin be the sin of believing in Jesus? We can talk about that in a different thread.

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. However, non-Messianic Jews are incomplete Jews

Hmm...how can one be "incomplete"? Because they believe
in Judaism and G-d and Torah, rather than Christianity?

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and for the Jewish people that non-Messianics like you shun, there needs to be an advocate.

Advocate all you want, but no branch of Judaism will accept you or
others like yourself. If you wish to deceive yourself and others by
claiming to be a Jew, that is your choice. All you do is bring shame
to your movement when this deception is revealed....because
no Jew will accept you, and will consider you calling yourself a Jew
to be a lie.

This is where I see the problem and agree with Sheitl. Actually I see two problems. Goy, it IS deception..not just because of which parent your lineage came through but because 3/16 isn't enough to make the top 5 ingredients on a cereal box! I'm 1/4 Italian but I don't go around telling people I'm Italian, cause I'm NOT. You can love Israel and the Jewish Messiah all you want, but please.... tell them you're a gentile who loves the Jewish people, etc.

And the "advocate" part...pray tell, who elected you advocate?

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Also, if you'd read my earlier posts, I explained why Julius was Jewish.

I did read them, and all I have seen is wishful thinking on your part
that you can find some Jewish ancestor, and thus deceive yourself
into thinking you are a Jew.
This is all quite sad....be proud to be the gentile that you are.

Yes, there is no shame in being gentile or even a heinz 57 gentile. Jesus made you kosher!

Ripley's Wrote:

Quote:

I realize that I'm not just some gentile sitting back and hearing about Jews and Israel in church. I'm a Jewish woman who has both salvation and judgement first, and these stories about the Jewish people are actually a part of my history.

1) "I'm not just some gentile...." ~ and neither am I. The story of God an Israel is real and true and applicable to all of us re: our humanity. I also know that Israel was the chosen instrument through which God would/did reveal Himself, His righteousness, our sinfulness, and Jesus, "the Jew", who is our Savior. The Nation He "wedded" Himself to. The apple of His eye. His Beloved. As such He has required more from them, and they have suffered on His behalf. And He is not through with Israel.

You took me out of context. I'm not anti-gentile nor anti-Jewish, and I know that the unsaved and cursed of Israel who are chosen will recieve blessings and salvation in the end.

GoyOfY'shua Wrote:

...and I know that the unsaved and cursed of Israel who are chosen will recieve blessings and salvation in the end.

Excuse me??? Would you explain that comment?

chow_woman Wrote:

This is where I see the problem and agree with Sheitl. Actually I see two problems. Goy, it IS deception..not just because of which parent your lineage came through but because 3/16 isn't enough to make the top 5 ingredients on a cereal box! I'm 1/4 Italian but I don't go around telling people I'm Italian, cause I'm NOT. You can love Israel and the Jewish Messiah all you want, but please.... tell them you're a gentile who loves the Jewish people, etc.

And the "advocate" part...pray tell, who elected you advocate?

I suppose that Menashe and Ephraim, and Peretz and Zerach, all of whom were 1/8 (or 2/16) Jewish and had gentile mothers (Joseph's wife and Tamar) all the way to gentile great-great-grandmothers (including Sarah) weren't Jewish, according to you; and that you'd refute Tanakh, since, apparently, gentiles aren't supposed to be the ancestors of tribes (i.e., bnei-Menashe)? Also, I volunteered to be an advocate for Jews like me who are constantly sideswiped and pushed aside, and outcasted and ostracized, by people like you and Sheitl Queen.

GoyOfY'shua Wrote:

For all of you criticizing me and calling me a pretender or not a Jewish woman, I have copies of documents, e-mails from a distant cousin of my dad, and other evidence that I'm patrilineally Jewish.

Daat Emet
Dr. Shaye Cohen, as J.R. Wilhelm cited, argued:

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What, then, is the reason for matrilineal descent? If traditional Judaism does not reckon Jewish identity by matrilineal descent for any of the reasons outlined above, what is the reason? Professor Shaye Cohen, who devoted an entire chapter to the origins of matrilineal descent in his book The Beginnings of Jewishness6, was ultimately forced to admit that he has no idea why the rabbis chose to break with biblical practice and institute matrilineality7. There is no clear reason that Judaism has to be matrilineal, except that it has been so for many centuries.

And there is even less reason that we should accept discrimination supported not merely by bad reasons, but by no reason at all.

Another website, though not updated but still having timeless information, and another document prove that I am patrilineally Jewish.

Anthony's mom was named Alexandria Alice Andrulewicz Czarnecki. She, unlike her daughter-in-law Mary, could not speak, read, or write English; and the difference on Julius' and Anthony's death certificates show that Mary was a native speaker of English. By the way, I'm sharing this also for only my personal use and to show that I'm patrilineally Jewish; and as for my knowledge of Anthony's death cause (which proves that this document is Anthony's death certificate as Julius' is Julius'), I didn't know that Anthony committed suicide until I recieved a copy of this document, and I was always told by my dad that he died of black lung.

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You took me out of context.

I apologize if I did that. I know that sometimes what we write does not "read" (to others) what we were trying to say.

Do the other "Jews like you" know you're their advocate?

chow_woman Wrote:

Do the other "Jews like you" know you're their advocate?

If I should find one who needs an advocate, (s)he would know.

Okay, lets just agree.

Goy is Patrilineally Jewish!!!