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I read that the American Family Association and Bill Wilder has lifted it's boycott of Ford products, after 2 years after 4 cases (points of contention) were met by the company.

Cause to celebrate especially for the heterosexual Ford product owners.

BTW bi in 1962 I drove  a "Joe the plumber" Ford Falcon.

Although there are heresies among us, let us never think we must pander to heresies for the sake of the almighty dollar or to support
the christian effort.


Blessings in Messiah

Sorry but I don't know what this is all about? Or the connection to faith or heterosexuals...???


But I still boycot Ford (and IBM) because of the ammount of workers they had in the camps...

Plus the Ford foundation (maybe not connected so much to the company anymore?) still a few years ago managed to sponsor anti-Israel and Jewish campaigns in South Africa...

I'm just not buying their products, but o.k. I'm just one in 7 billion...
And I will not buy BMW and Bayer or BASF or Family Bush either, just a matter of prinsiple.
But you can't keep up with things, there are so many unethicall companies. But these where a force behind and parttakers the killing of millions, so for me on the highest level of being against my nation...

I think you are right, Yetzirah. Economic sanctions just seem to create
a poorer picture of those able to enforce them, when the offense (or supposed offense) lies with a  minority, mgmt. or leadership that chose to offend, and the majority under that minority has no decision or choice in the resolution of the problem due to the same economic constraints imposed on them without their input.

You make some pretty good points .

If you would like I have a number of New Testament scriptures that explain, how to respond to situations out of our control as believers, Y'shua and Paul were recorded as saying.

I don't think they are worth mentioning now that I see the direction this thread is heading, as far as letting personal battles influence the tenor of the posts.

After all, one skillfull in the word can try and use for it for revenge, a grudge, personal gain, or even to satisfy an "angy" attitude.

Let every man be fully persuaded. Make full proof of your ministry

Shalom to you and Cor 517, no negative feelings, I have no right to them.

O.K. Daveed thanks, if you want you can put it via the personal mailbox.

but first off all Ford, IBM, Coca Cola etc. where not out of controll. They ''personally'' decidede to sponsor the German war partly for economicall reasons. But especially IBM and Ford decided to have workers in the German Camps, and they must have known about the ''working conditions'' overthere. IBM had even agents that went more then once a month to all camps to check if the computers where still working fine, also for Nazi's at unexpacted moments they might have come to fix the systems.

Send me the texts. Except if those teksts are only about forgiveness etc.
Not holding your Grudge is something else than not sponsering companies who never realy said sorry etc.  I think I am allowed to have negative feelings towards murderers, wich at least means not to sponsor them + not to act as if they are my friends or that they might come in heaven etc.

Greetings

Yetzirah231, Shalom.  

Whoa! OK, I guess I read the wrong history books, or slept through 'IBM, FORD, and Coca Cola, 101,' but I have never heard about what you allude to, in your contempt for those companies.  If you have documentation of a travesty against Israel, will you please share a few documentations?  Your contempt, I presume, has some foundation, and I will share with you that contempt, but you must tell me something more than just 'Trust me' type statements.

If you are correct, you have reason to reject supporting those companies by not purchasing their products.  If correct, all should be saddened, as regards the 'then' leadership of those companies. We must then pray that those three companies, and any other earthly entity, are never again headed by people of that ilk.  

I presume, additionally, though you do not address that aspect, you do not purchase any product, manufactured in Germany, Italy, or for that matter, any European country, who was ever under, or contaminated through association, with Germany, or any country hostile to Israel.  What you profess cannot be content with hating only three companies, when there are countries more worthy.

If you are condemning Ford, Coca Cola, and IBM, through 'false witness,' be it yours, or of someone  else, Shame on you.  I say this, only, and purely, to ask you to be sure that you are correct in your assertion.

Truly, I desire to know truth, so any helpful direction to that truth is greatly appreciated. I have to admit, however, I tend not to condemn inanimate objects, or people, only the 'act,' and then prayerfully.  

In Messiah, His Shalom, to you, and to one and all. 
May you learn to forgive those who have wronged you, individually, and Nationally.  YHVH knows how to take vengeance.
Arley

Henry Ford was an anti-Jewish man. In fact, Henry Ford was quoted as once saying:



The full article is at the webpage for the article.

Navyblue

You're correct I don't buy BMW etc. as I wrote.
The U.S.A. had stadions full of Nazi's mainly ex-Germans, maybe the U.S. is the most German state outside of Germany...

So a lot of companies where forced to have slave labour, or sometimes there was no way around it.
But Companies think about themselves, for the U.S.A. as a not occupied nation, with boycots against Germany after WW-I  it was not correct that Coca Cola invented Fanta, just to go around the trade-boycot. But besides that, the local CocaCola directory did put advertisements in the NSDAP-leaflets etc.
So for Coca Cola it was only ''tradingmistakes''. Just search in google or so.

Henry Ford made annual birthday gifts of 50,000 deutsch marks to Adolph Hitler. He was an anti semite. It's hard to proof that they knew much about the real concentrationcamps. But Ford kept their own company running with at least about 4000 POW's and ''enemies of the German state''. Still in South America in the early 2000's the Ford company sponsored for over a million a anti-Israel campain.
One artikel:
more against ford
FORD also in Buchenwald
more moderate academic
Even after the war, the American government wanted to give Ford the Volkswagen company as a bonus... But Henry Ford refused... They payed also reperationfunds to Holocaustfund in Germany. But never where open about policies...

for IBM later. But they realy know what was happening in the camps. Just google a bit.
Even Prescot Bush with Standard Oil made deals with AG-Farben how to devide companies and benefits in the world in the 1920's.. long story, but at the same evening that the Kosovo war was ended in the 1990's the new Standard Oil could take over parts of AG-Farben because during the Yugoslavian war was decided what Germany still had for kind of depts, to say it simple. And only after that war the U.N. decided that U.S.A.-companies, could take shares of old Nazi-companies...  It's still in the background

Yetzira231 Shalom.

Thank you for your response.  Your words convince me that you truly condemn many people, and companies that had affiliation with 'Nazi' Germany during WW-ll, and I am sorry you have such deep, apparent, hatred for so many.  You seem to convey your emotion, of hatred, and rejection, against todays, hopfully innocent, with equal measure to that you espouse against those of WW-ll Nazi anti-Semitism of old.

I will not argue the point with you, but please allow me to comment, as I see this problem:

You, condemn.  Please show yourself where YHVH Elohim, gave you that right.  Ah, yes, He says, to the extent: "Have no fear, I, YHVH Elohim, am here, and I (repeat-'I') will take retribution upon those who hate, and hurt you, my people." (I paraphrase)

I find it sad that your 'remembering' goes to the extent that you condemn people, of today, for deeds done, against Israel, generations ago, especially when there are so many anti-Semites, running around today, trying to wipe out Israel.  Again, I know of no place in Tanach, or NT, where we, mortals, are given the right to condemn three or four generations, of family members for the deeds of their 'fathers.'  In short, your hatred may well be self destructive. How much hatred can one mortal body contain, and espouse?

I could, probably, espouse numerous platitudes, as to the folly of your feelings, but you sound so convinced, and determined, I will not try.

I wish you well, in your present mortality, and in the eternal immortality that you are designing, through your behavior, and attitudes, and probable deeds, of today.

In Messiah, His Shalom, and Love, for and to you.  Arley

Shalom Navyblue,

I didn't say that I hate them. I just don't buy their stuff. O.k. I drink Coca Cola, o.k. I might sit in my friends FORD. But FORD reminds me of family members who died, who I could have know. Grandmothers etc. o.k. it is 2 generations but it had effect on my parents...
And I write that FORD didn't change it ways, so it is not about Generations ago. I just don't buy their stuff.

If HaShem says he will take care of the judgment. Does it mean I have to buy stuff from somebody who shot my father? Do I have to send my kid to a school where some teachers where childmolesters (and the risk that they might fall back into it)?. I can choose within the boundries my own do's and don'ts.
And why are anti-semites today worce than generations ago???
Is it written in Tenach that I should hate sinners, or love them??? I should bring back a cow of my enemy if it walks in my field. I should first consider and offer peace with nations / people who want to attack me...
But that I have to go out and buy his cows, while I can buy cows from a friend also, is an easy option.
But Yes I bought a raincoat and socks etc. in the Arab market. I'm not against persons themselves. And from some Jews or Christians that I don't trust I might also not buy a thing.

The Almighty said that we couldn't marry male-Moabites for a certain amount of generations. With some people it was 10 withs some 4 and with Amelek NEVER. So if The Almighty keeps his Grudge, who Am I to Go against HIS will? Or who Am I to turn into some flowerpower-religion that everybody should love everybody. No to Judaism The Almighty is Love AND Judgement.
O.K. HIS Judgement. But I don't have to buy Cuban Sigars if I don't want to... (I might like them).

Boycotts are quite common. A lot of Protestant Churches Boycot Israel, or the Catholic Church.
The U.S.A. boycots Israel if we trade to much with India or China. That is just a statement. So why do you turn it into hate and all kind off strong terms?

The Intro of this topic begins also about Hetrosexual-people. So I questioned myself what it had to do with FORD? Something against gay-people? And by the way, why are so many Christians than against gay-people within writings, sayings... If God will take care of it...?

To write about the processes, might also help to understand the Serbs who suffered from western trade-deals to sponsor the war. Or to understand how Shell and Standard Oil wanted to get their property back, of which Saddam Hussein decided that the Land belonged to the Iraki's and not to the west. The west needs cheap Oil so they planned the war about 20 years ago. It just doesn't have to do much with what you see on TV.
I also don't completely understand the hatred of the lies, that there where wapons off mass destruction.
But most people should understand facts first, before they make boundries.

Wow, Yetzirah! Thanks for sharing!  Makes all the more happy that I drive a Chevy, I don't drink pop and I don't have an IBM!   Actually, I could see how these anti-sematic companies would make Yetzirah feel.  I mean we're talking about his family, his heritage, his beliefs and most importantly his G-d (and ours)!   I don't think Yetzirah is being begrudging towards the innocent workers personally per sei but for what the companies in the past have stood for.  Just remember, Yetzirah, G-d saw it all too.  He has not forgotten.  Shalom!!!