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I'd like to respectfully ask any "Oneness" believers out there an honest, simple and direct question:

If the Bible uses the personal pronouns "we", "us", "our", and uses words like "self" in relation to Yeshua and the Father "I can of my own self do nothing", "He glorified not himself to be high priest", etc. -- indeed, if Yeshua even said he and the Father were "two persons" (Jhn 8:16-18) -- he definitely did not say "two natures" but rather "two anthropos" or persons in the Greek--

Then why is it supposedly wrong to speak of more than one "person" in God's essential nature?  You can be a strict Unitarian who believes in only one Triune God.

Since the Bible permits no private interpretation, we must use the publicly accepted definitions of articles of speech and rules of grammar when reading the Word (such as personal pronouns, the word "self", etc.) which identify persons.

I think it is fair to politely question Oneness believers on the grounds of it requiring a private interpretation of the Bible's language and grammar that does not accept the universal definitions of words like "they", "their", "we", "us", and "our" all of which are used to identify distinct persons.

last point....we,us our identify distinct persons...never said what have "we" here......let us see what "we" have.......what have "we" gotten ourselves into....and been alone when you have said it?  doesn't prove there is more than one person.

Jesus said he was a witness and the Father was a witness....one was flesh one was Spirit....only one person I see is Jesus.

Jesus said in He was the Father in John 14:7,9 then stated that His flesh was going to the Father which is His Glory that recieved Him in ! Tim 3:16

also Word = God ....Word became flesh...God became flesh

3 that bare withness in heaven...Father(Spirit) Word(God/Spirit) and the Holy Ghsot and these three are one "Spirit"

1Jo 5:8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.  

Spirit is God Himself in flesh....Jesus

it is passing strange that if there were three persons that nowhere is that written anywhere in scripture.

last point....we,us our identify distinct persons...never said what have "we" here......let us see what "we" have.......what have "we" gotten ourselves into....and been alone when you have said it?  doesn't prove there is more than one person.

So God was using plural words for no reason? why did God just say I will created God in my image  instead let us created?



3 that bare withness in heaven...Father(Spirit) Word(God/Spirit) and the Holy Ghsot and these three are one "Spirit"

The father is The father The word is Jesus and Holy Ghost is the holy ghost.

3 in one.



Jesus said he was a witness and the Father was a witness....one was flesh one was Spirit....only one person I see is Jesus.

so you limited a person being only a person if it has flesh.

prophet what also makes someone a person is Character.

maybe you should study The Character of the father Son and HG you will find some different s and  good amount of similarity.

As you clearly saw from the above post, Yeshua said that He and the Father were "two persons" (anthropos in Greek).  You have done nothing to address the standing challenge, in particular that Yeshua made a firm and direct statement of "two persons".

The Son of God is not mere "flesh" but a resurrected life giving Spirit:




Please address the original question in the post in your reply next time?  It was a very specific question about the objective meaning of language in the Bible.

All you've done is offered a subject restatement of the verse in question, which actually proves my point:  Oneness theologians must "re-write" the Scripture before explaining it -- they can't accept the publicly accepted definitions of the ACTUAL words of the Bible themselves.

correction on post 3


why did God just say I will created God in my image  instead let us created?


I meant why did God just say I will created man in my image?

last point....we,us our identify distinct persons...never said what have "we" here......let us see what "we" have.......what have "we" gotten ourselves into....and been alone when you have said it?  doesn't prove there is more than one person.


Prophet When I'm by my self I usually say what had I gotten my self into not what we.

Sugarman,

I agree with you.  Using the words "we", "us" and "our", as Yeshua did of his father, has an objective, publicly accepted definition.  Colossians 2:3 speaks of God and Messiah, "in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom."

Yeshua also used the word "self" as well as the word "will" to distinguish his person from that of the Father. So did the Holy Spirit in writing Hebrews, saying of Messiah, "He glorified not himself to be high priest, but He that said unto Him, sit thou at my right hand...".  Word up!

The Apostle John speaks of "God the Father, and from Jesus Christ, who is the Son of the Father."  The New Testament has dozens of verses of like this, starting with Galatians 1:1-3 and on down the line.

Even when the truth of Scripture of plainly shown to some people in love, they cannot accept it because they prefer their private interpretation of the Word of God, changing the word "person" into "nature" and the word "Son" in "flesh" in their minds BEFORE they talk about it.

If you let non-orthodox groups define the words with their own private definitions, of course by their own newly imposed rules they are going to win the debate.

We need to remind them that NO verse has any private interpretation.  If it is kosher to say that the "Spirit of God" is "God the Holy Spirit", then it is kosher to say that the "Son of God" is "God the Son". (Hebrews 1:8)  Trinitarians have always taught that as the Son, God had two natures human and divine.  Don't allow them to cloud the issue by quoting our orthodox Christian theology out of context.

One Being, three persons.  One "what", three "who"s.

Nice to ask a question you had no intention of talking about honestily...how typical.
As to your above assertion maybe you should actually read the Bible.

One Spirt =God
One Person = Jesus
One Godhead = Jesus

Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

what is the Godhead? father,son and Holy Ghost
who is the vessel of the Godhead?....Jesus

Word = God = Jesus



Scripture says:

Phl 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God

no where does it say as you claim above that the Holy Ghost or the father are equal to anyone and Jesus was equal to God since He is the Person of God there is no persons equal or otherwise as God Himself states:

Isa 40:25 To whom then will ye liken me, or shall I be equal? saith the Holy One.

Isa 46:5 To whom will ye liken me, and make [me] equal, and compare me, that we may be like?  

Now either God doesn't know what He is talking about(maybe He needs an optometrist) since he can't seem to see these so called co equal perosn that you state are beside Him or is it below Him?

and its funny how in scripture after scripture He says there is none beside Him yet you say there is 3 others....hmmm
(Isa 43:11,44:6,44:8,45:5,45:6,45:21 and Hosea 13:4  

Nice to ask a question you had no intention of talking about honestily...how typical.
As to your above assertion maybe you should actually read the Bible.

One Spirt =God
One Person = Jesus
One Godhead = Jesus

Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

what is the Godhead? father,son and Holy Ghost
who is the vessel of the Godhead?....Jesus

Word = God = Jesus

prophet Jesus also said I'm in The Father so this is like saying I'm in The Godhead.

I am the Father," but rather, "I am in the Father and the Father is in Me" (v. 10, repeated in v. 11; cf. 10:38).

Oneness believers frequently cite the second part of this last statement, "the Father is in Me," to mean that the deity ("Father") dwells in the humanity ("Son") of Jesus. This view, however, fails to explain the first part of the sentence, "I am in the Father," which in Oneness terms would have to mean that the human nature of Jesus dwells in the deity -- the opposite of what they believe. Moreover, it fails to account for the fact that "in this same context," as well as elsewhere, Jesus uses this sort of expression to denote His unity with believers: "In that day you shall know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you" (v. 20; cf. 17:21-23).

http://www.gospeloutreach.net/optrin.html

also in end prophet when Jesus walk on earth he had The father and The holy spirit in him and this shows fully The God head was in him.