JFJ Forums - Part 2 First century Believer in Yeshua

sugarman Wrote:

The law is not done by the outward doing of the law but the love that you show to people that fulfilled all of The Law.

http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Article...vance.html

As For The trinity Jesus is separate from the father.

Jesus is equal to The father in essence nature but not in rank.

"Not in rank"? What about the Shema?

YehudiahOfYeshua Wrote:

sugarman Wrote:

The law is not done by the outward doing of the law but the love that you show to people that fulfilled all of The Law.

http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Article...vance.html

As For The trinity Jesus is separate from the father.

Jesus is equal to The father in essence nature but not in rank.

"Not in rank"? What about the Shema?

The sheama teaches that Echad plural of One is in The Godhead.

Plural as in The father son and Holy ghost.

The trinity teaches that they are distinct persons. Jesus himself said The father is Greater then I.

The father Son and HG are equal in the sense they are all God they all have the same essence The same nature of there being but Jesus when it comes to Rank again he said The father is greater Then I. this how I think The trinity teaches equal in nature and power but not in rank

Kitten Wrote:

sugarman
We agree that "we are not under the law" and that "love fulfills the law".

The different is what we understand these statements to mean.
"Not being under the law" means to me to keep the law out of love and not requirement.
"love fulfills the law" to me means we keep the law as written on our hearts and this includes our thoughts not just our actions.
Isaiah predicted the son of the stranger keeping the sabbath and perhaps the festival sabbaths.
Isa 56:3   Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I [am] a dry tree.
Isa 56:4   For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose [the things] that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
Isa 56:5   Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
Isa 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
Isa 56:7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices [shall be] accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

The Thing is The law on our hearts are not from the tablet of stone

http://www.formeradventist.com/discus/me...1237650197

read post number 6-7 by bobj

my view Kitten On what love fulfills The law means to me not keeping the regulations and commands that paul said Died in the flesh of Christ But to help others in any possible way, that is The second command The First is to Love God which is to follow his commands that Apply to us believers.

sugarman
It is Jeremiah that first speaks of the law being written on our hearts.
Jer 31:31   ¶   Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Jer 31:32    Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day [that] I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Jer 31:33    But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
It's not a different law but a different connection to the law.

Kitten Wrote:

sugarman
It is Jeremiah that first speaks of the law being written on our hearts.
Jer 31:31   ¶   Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Jer 31:32    Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day [that] I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Jer 31:33    But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
It's not a different law but a different connection to the law.

Did you miss the part where God said not base on The Covenat that I made with their forefathers?

Also Did you read the Link? it deals prettu much with the law being written on our hearts.

Kitten Wrote:

sugarman
It is Jeremiah that first speaks of the law being written on our hearts.
Jer 31:31   ¶   Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Jer 31:32    Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day [that] I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Jer 31:33    But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
It's not a different law but a different connection to the law.

It's not a different law but a different connection to the law.

This I can agree with because The Law the Different connection is not the outward doing each command but loving others that simple Love for God and his commands which we are told to abide TO that leaves no opition to say pick and choose also loving others.

if One view of law keeping is puting them back under The Old coverant and having to keep the Sinai Law in the whole just like ancient israel did or more like tryed to then I think they miss The whole point on what paul on what paul means by love fulfilles The law.

paul taught that The law ( singular) died in jesus flesh on The cross so we do know for sure paul thought of keeping The law (singular) as in all 613 laws is not the way of keeping the law nor what it means by The law is written on our hearts.

Jer 31:33    But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
This verse says exactly what the new covenant is.  It is "my law"  the pronoun my refers to "God". God writes his law in our hearts.  The very same law a different attitude toward it the same attitude that David had but not all of Israel had this attitude.
Psa 19:7      The law of the LORD [is] perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD [is] sure, making wise the simple.
Psa 19:8    The statutes of the LORD [are] right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD [is] pure, enlightening the eyes.
Psa 19:9    The fear of the LORD [is] clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD [are] true [and] righteous altogether.
Psa 19:10    More to be desired [are they] than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
Psa 19:11    Moreover by them is thy servant warned: [and] in keeping of them [there is] great reward.
The law written on your heart is capable of converting the soul.  They are to be desired because they are a very great reward.

Kitten Wrote:

Jer 31:33    But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
This verse says exactly what the new covenant is.  It is "my law"  the pronoun my refers to "God". God writes his law in our hearts.  The very same law a different attitude toward it the same attitude that David had but not all of Israel had this attitude.
Psa 19:7      The law of the LORD [is] perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD [is] sure, making wise the simple.
Psa 19:8    The statutes of the LORD [are] right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD [is] pure, enlightening the eyes.
Psa 19:9    The fear of the LORD [is] clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD [are] true [and] righteous altogether.
Psa 19:10    More to be desired [are they] than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
Psa 19:11    Moreover by them is thy servant warned: [and] in keeping of them [there is] great reward.
The law written on your heart is capable of converting the soul.  They are to be desired because they are a very great reward.

This verse says exactly what the new covenant is.  It is "my law"  the pronoun my refers to "God". God writes his law in our hearts.  The very same law a different attitude toward it the same attitude that David had but not all of Israel had this attitude.

You still  do not understand The new covenant is not base on the Coverant of the fore fathers as Jeremiah also says.

The law written on our hearts IS not base On how the ancient israel was commanded to try to keep which they failed a lot.

I ask again did you read the site?

According to you it seems you hold to the law never change it is to be kept the same way from day 1 But it also seems you do not understand the NT does not teach this. The law written in our hearts is The law of christ which is in Gal which is to help others.

Romans 13:8 (Amplified Bible)

8Keep out of debt and owe no man anything, except to love one another; for he who loves his neighbor [who practices loving others] has fulfilled the Law [relating to one's fellowmen, meeting all its requirements].

Galatians 6:2 (Amplified Bible)

2Bear (endure, carry) one another's burdens and [a]troublesome moral faults, and in this way fulfill and observe perfectly the law of Christ (the Messiah) and complete [b]what is lacking [in your obedience to it].

romans 13:8  teaches loving others fulfills  The WHOLE law not that we need to keep it in the singular state.

The law of Christ is to help others which is the seem as loving others

sugarman Wrote:

The father Son and HG are equal in the sense they are all God they all have the same essence The same nature of there being but Jesus when it comes to Rank again he said The father is greater Then I. this how I think The trinity teaches equal in nature and power but not in rank

Show us the scripture stating they are equal or where the word rank is ever mentioned....oh yeah there isn't one...

Jesus as a man was inferior to the Father but He is the Father incarnate.

You keep missing that point Word = God = flesh = Jesus ....God is Jesus in the flesh ONE...ECHAD...maybe you should listen to DR brown debate with the Orthodox Rabbie....ECHAD is ONE and ONLY ONE there is NO TRINITY.....no rank....no equalization....

Jesus did not consider it robbery to be equal with God because HE IS GOD. and HE IS THE HOLY GHOST/SPIRIT...and as the good Rabbi pointed out trinity doctrine goes all the way back to Nimrod...egypt....even Islam ....JEws are Monotheistic....ONE GOD ALONE.....