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Rabbi
#1
Question 
  I have often wondered about Rabbis' and how they were chosen (?). That sounds odd to me. Being a Gentile, the process is one I am not familiar with. Also, if they are supposed to be "chosen by the disciple", why was Jesus doing the choosing? Please help!!
#2
bkruffin Wrote:  I have often wondered about Rabbis' and how they were chosen (?). That sounds odd to me. Being a Gentile, the process is one I am not familiar with. Also, if they are supposed to be "chosen by the disciple", why was Jesus doing the choosing? Please help!!

A Rabbi cannot be compared to a Minister or Christian Priest. They are a Jewish scholar qualified to teach or interpret Jewish law.

They are not "chosen". They study to become Rabbi's. Those are the basics. Jesus studied to be a Rabbi. Someone taught him the Law.


Avraham
#3
Rabbi's don't always have to be chosen.
A person becomes a rabbi by studying (like in a bible college), if he finishes Mishna and many other books, he gets tested, his caracter and other skills should be tested too.
But a rabbi doesn't have to be always a leader of a community.

Within a community it depends if they have a democratic structure/tradition than a rabbi get's chosen by voting. In some other communities a rabbi gets appointed. A rabbi can also start his own kind of comunity (within the religious guidelines). So then it might be not so weird that a rabbi choses his students.

In the days of Jesus it was not all done a bit different and experimental, In those days there was still a Sanhedrin, a non-Jewish King etc. so the structures of government was shaken up, partly corrupted by the Romans, partly because there where allready all kind of politicall groups outside of the Sanhedrin system.

And was Jesus actually a rabbi? Didn't he say that people shouldn't call themselves rabbi's or teachers?
Besides that it's for every Jew done within tradition that he has some people he learns from, and has some students. So they chose eachother.

A rabbi is also not a priest, or the main person who does the religious service. In that sence Jesus felt himsef maybe more like a messenger.
#4
Please allow me to be a little clearer. I have my theories on this, but nothing to verify them!
It has been told to me that when a young man gets to a certain level of education, he seeks a Rabbi for further, more specific training. When the Rabbi is approached by the candidate, he questions the young man to determine if he has the qualities necessary to carry his mantle to the rest of the world; to find out if he has what it takes to do what the Rabbi does, to be him for the world. If they are found "wanting", he sends them home to apprentice themselves to the family business and hope for the best.
When Jesus was traveling around in the first part of His ministry, He chose certain people and told them to follow Him! My theory is that by doing this to men that had already been told to go home and work the family business, He was telling these people (the stone the builder rejected) they had what it took! They were capable of taking His mantle on themselves, to be Him for the world!
The problem is, I don't know if what I have been told is correct! What I have concluded from this sounds pretty good, but.....
Where can I find the resources to verify these things? Please help.
#5
Thank you so much for your help (Told you I was a Gentile.)! The one problem I have is that now I have  to begin again with the lesson I was preparing.  That is not a real problem, I just  had information that turned out to be MIS-information and attempted to form a lesson from that! Lesson learned! I have so much to learn.
#6
Quote:It has been told to me that when a young man gets to a certain level of education, he seeks a Rabbi for further, more specific training.

For everybody, young-old person, man or female it's recommanded to ask a rabbi for specific training. No level of education is requiered, for there is no such thing as ''the more dumb, the less questions can anybody ask.''
Indeed if somebody wants to become a rabbi, he has to be trained by a good know rabbi, and tested by at least 3 other rabbi's.
If somebody wants to lead prayers, he can be trained by somebody he leads the prayers now. Not for all kind of things the title rabbi is requiered.

A rabbi is not a priest. A rabbi has responsibilities and should be trustworthy etc. but in Judaism we don't use the word 'holy' or so for a position, for our word 'holy' means something else. And a rabbi can make mistakes, is a human as others, just a teacher more or the less.

So I don't understand your idea of going back to the family-business? Maybe Jesus did, but that doesn't make you a rabbi by hoping for the best. No you have to read all kind of books, to understand details in the Law and community-life.

In Jesus times there where hardly ''local'' rabbi's, most people did work. Only the Sanhedrin that excisted decades after Jesus died, had professionals who's only job was to be busy with studying the law etc.

Because the Romans corrupted the Sanhedrin, by putting their own Kings and priests, than it started to be more common that people worked outside of Gods chosen system, and mainly since than synagogues started to appear, with local teachers who did ran away from the Roman system.

Before that most things where in Jerusalem more central decided. Now all kind of local customs started to appear. And that is what Jesus also started, he had some own customs, and his disciples had a bit different traditions here and there, and Jesus gave commentaries like any other would. For most people there was no way to ask the Sanhedrin anymore.

Before the Romans, the Temple and Sanhedrin excisted of Priests and Levites, who did Gods work. The other tribes had to work mainly, that was God's ideal.
Jesus took workers, and because he claimed to be priest in the order of Melchizedek, Jesus allready created a renewed system, where most would not have agreed with.
#7
I have become aware, from my Bible reading, that Jesus angered many of the Jewish leaders of the day.  He did so through outright onslaught of their ways; "generation of vipers" , "liars, and the truth is not in you!", etc.
Am I to understand, from what you stated before, that because He called workers from their jobs, this would have angered them as well because it went against the desired tradition?
  I understand that we each have a place we need to be; a place to serve, even if we do not see this as a place of "great glory", because our glory is in Christ. Why, then (if I have understood your position), would it be undesirable for them to be taken from their work? Especially if a Teacher is calling them? I feel I am missing something, but I'm not sure where.
#8
  The idea that would have been most offensive to people at that time, then, would have been because He was calling men from non-Levite tribes to this work?
  O.K. ; God's ideal for people. God's ideal for people at one time was for them to never eat certain kinds of meat, yet in a vision that Peter had on a rooftop, God stepped away from that and stated that NO animal was unclean; Was Jesus not doing the same thing with this? No particular tribe for Levitical work, no certain type for Ministry? A person can be called for His work from any tribe. Could this be what He was doing? If this is true it would explain why the Sanhedrin would have been so angry, they were so longer "set apart" from the rest!
#9
Avraham Wrote:
bkruffin Wrote:  I have often wondered about Rabbis' and how they were chosen (?). That sounds odd to me. Being a Gentile, the process is one I am not familiar with. Also, if they are supposed to be "chosen by the disciple", why was Jesus doing the choosing? Please help!!

A Rabbi cannot be compared to a Minister or Christian Priest. They are a Jewish scholar qualified to teach or interpret Jewish law.

They are not "chosen". They study to become Rabbi's. Those are the basics. Jesus studied to be a Rabbi. Someone taught him the Law.


Avraham
Jesus is both King of Israel and High Priest. His Father taught Him.
Rabbi's do not teach Jewish Law.
They teach what Rabbi's taught them and not what God gave to men.
Jesus teaches us God's Laws.
They are written in our hearts, Rabbi's omly mangle what Moses received from God.
Some of us are Priest's before God.
One modern Jewish scholar is Dr Michael Brown.
#10
Bkruffin, Shalom,

Indeed Jesus did anger people by not walking humble with his God, by using those kind of words towards others.
At the other hand discussions and searching for the Truth within different opinions is normal in Judaism. In an imperfect world it’s hard I think to learn without offending each other, but Jesus seemed to use those kind of words on purpose.

It’s not that he called workers from their Jobs that angered people. The Almighty ordered and desired that Levites and Priest did Jobs in the Temple. Jesus didn’t ask his disciples to do jobs in the Temple, or to behave like priests or Levites.
Jesus said about himself that he was priest in the order of Melchizedek (that was a priest outside of the Temple). Jews are in the bible not asked to be priests like Melchizedek or Yethro. So there are questions what Jesus wanted to establish with that saying. But he never asked his disciples to become priests etc.
And it’s allowed to ask workers as pupils. All Jews (Levites aswell as non-Levites, Priests) are asked to learn, and how and when one does it, depends on the situation at that time, or who asks. But the only task of Levites and Priests was in the Temple. The MAIN task of other tribes was working, but study or hobby was not forbidden.

Ministry is not Jewish terminology, But we were asked to be a Light among the nations. To present The Almighty, is not specifically a Priestly task, nor specifically a Levite task, everybody can do his own part. So ministry is not special at all in Judaism, it’s just a commandment (not meaning evangelizing), and it was already: not a particular tribe for ministry.
Jesus didn’t ask anybody from the Sanhedrin, nor Levites nor Priests to be a disciple, so he only asked workers. Because The Almighty said that Levites and Priest had to do Gods work in The Temple, Jesus seemed to respect that separation that The Almighty wanted.


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