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Rashi confirms the VOICE of  HASHEM as HASHEM
#1
In Genesis 3:8,
    "They heard the VOICE of HASHEM G-D walking in the Garden toward the direction of the sun; and the man and his wife hid...."

Rashi comments:
"They heard...I have come for nothing but the simple meaning of Scripture and for aggadah, which resolves the words of Scripture with each word stated in its proper framework, and with its correct meaning.
        'they heard the VOICE of the Holy One', Blessed is He, 'WHO was walking in the Garden'...toward the direction of the sun ...in the tenth (hour)."

Judaism says G-D is incorporeal, and invisible...hence, unable to walk in a visible manner.  But this is refuted in Genesis 18 and many passages of Tenach.  Rashi knows this and refutes the notion.  This is why he sets the commentary of this above verse of Genesis 3:8 up in this way.

In the passage of Genesis 18:1 ff., HASHEM appears as a man...HASHEM appears as a man...HASHEM appears as a man to Abraham on the plains of Mamre.   He is called "The Holy One" by Rashi.  This HASHEM who appears as a man, is accompanied by two angels of Lot's deliverance.  

There is absolutely no doubt, over and over, that Rashi views this HASHEM at Mamre -- and His Garden appearance also -- as visible.  

Hence, Rashi himself, among the greatest of rabbinic commentators, recognizes the mystery of the VOICE of HASHEM as HASHEM in these two passages by its simple meaning and non-halikah interpretation.  

Shalom.

Any one like to add?
#2
Rashi confirms no such thing.  If he ever did, all his commentaries would be forever expunged from the Jewish record.  That voice was HEARD, and that is Rashi's plain words, not SEEN visually.    

Try again.
#3
Chaim,
     Check with Jewish Theological seminaries or rabbinic scholars on Rashi...these teach that the "Voice of HASHEM walks in the garden, to which Rashi affirms as 'walking', but then he leaves it alone as unexpounded upon", or words to this effect.  He then goes on to talk about walking into the sun in the 10th hour of the day.  

    Chasidic editions of Chumash with Rashi and elucidations upon Rashi have also stated to this effect also.

     The Noachide site for Judaizing the nations also takes such a view of this VOICE walking, and are puzzled by it as well.  

Apparently you seem to hope we are ignorant of such things.  This is like what was expected of Pilate:

"Perhaps it was because that I am not a Jew that this nation of Yours and the First Priests [the 7 elders of Israel] delivered you up to me.  What did you do?"  (John 18:35, translation mine)

Even Pilate was shrewd enough to see Jesus was unrighteously delivered up to him for death by the Sanhedrin's 7 elders and its extremist faction of 23.  For this cause, even when he couldn't prevent innocent blood, Pilate officially recognized Jesus as the rightful king of the Jews, and declared Him as innocent by both ritual and decree.  The elders who led Israel astray in regards to Jesus accepted the blood upon their own heads.  In our own day, when people cry out or "truth", they call out for the sacrificial son Isaac in Jesus, the son of Abraham or lovingkindness (the Father).

Is it our fault that when they hear what they cry out for, that there are some who cry out, "Quick, stop up your ears with unbelief and dissent!"?   And if that truth is like the wail of a tornado siren, telling these souls to quickly hide in HASHEM through their only means of Salvation in Yeshua, I certainly am glad to not have to face the accountability that the one who deceived these will have to face in the Day of Judgement before G-D. 

 If you fail to grasp these words, please wait until your emotion isn't clouding their absorption...as I tend to write with a detachment of emotion, and restrict my words as much into an emotion-free vacuum or purely mental confinement as I can.  If I have failed in this...I apologize to you and any one else I have offended over these past months. Thanks.

#4
I don't see what you've proven with Rashi or anything else. A moving "voice" can be just that....an imageless voice or sound that one hears getting closer or going further away.  The last time I went to the cinema to watch a movie, I and hundreds of others could hear a voice or voices that seemed to get closer to us or further away.  So?  Rashi never stated that this voice was attached to a figure or image.

Now go back to that "voice" from Deut 30:2 and 30:8.  Is that Jesus or just the voice of God commanding His laws at Sinai over 3000 years ago?  

Deut 30:2. and you will return to the Lord, your God, with all your heart and with all your soul, and you will listen to His voice according to all that I am commanding you this day you and your children,

Deut 30:8. And you will return and listen to the voice of the Lord, and fulfill all His commandments, which I command you this day.


Seems this voice is just a figurative voice, not a persona.  No more than God's figurative arms, eyes, hands, feet, wings, etc.  

You should also look at Proverbs 8:26, Exodus 10:5, Isaiah 1:2, Numbers 11:31, Numbers 16:32, Isaiah 24:16, Daniel 10:4, Exodus 2:3, Exodus 15:8, Ezekiel 38:12, Jonah 2:3, Job 38:8 and Jeremiah 31:8 as examples where in the earth itself is described as having, respectively, a head, eyes, ears, a face, a mouth, a wing, a hand, lips, a heart, a navel, a belly, a womb, and a thigh. Surely these meanings cannot be taken literally either.

All anthropomorphisms.  

Instead of worshipping a voice, word, or image - your focus should be on the one invisible, eternal and infinite God almighty.

#5
G-D is called EL SHADDAI, do we designate his "force" or "strength"

G-D is called "the G-D who sees me", but only Talmud and masons generally called HIM the "all-seeing eye"...meaning G-D in their say so.

G-D is called a "banner" or "standard" of Righteousness, but it is a designation of a person, not an object.

The VOICE is more than "qol", it is the person called "Logos".  He is called the "Angel of HASHEM" as HASHEM, because He alone is HASHEM of Hosts: who can say come here, go there, pick up and carry, etc.  

You really need to look into your Hebrew and Greek and come back when you have something.  Thanks.
#6
P. S., you might also want to check out Exodus 19:19 a little closer, and how "b'qol" is used and translated as well.  Is it "in",  "with", "regarding", or "having come as" in the "beth"...which also means "house" when separated > cf. Psalm 26:8, 84:4, 118:26.
#7
In his commentary to Bamidbar (Numbers) 13:2, Rashi says in the Hebrew: "And Moses consulted the Shekinah, (who) said, 'I told them that it [the Land] is good.'"

The Shekinah is the manifest presence of the Holy Spirit, the third person of the Trinity.

Jesus says that we have never heard the Father's Voice nor seen His shape.  We have, however, had instances where man has heard and spoke with the pre-Incarnate Son, and heard also the Holy Spirit.

Both Jesus and the Holy Spirit have fulfilled their ministries as both G-D and mediators.  Jesus is the mediator between G-D the Father and man, the Holy Spirit apparently is the person of the G-Dhead that directs our attention to Jesus as our deliverance from sin and death.

In effect, the Holy Spirit is likened to the Voice of our Heavenly Mother...the One the Roman Catholics try to disinherit with the pseudo of the "perpetual virgin Mary". The Shekinah isn't just a presence, or light, it is the manifestation of the outward sign of the Holy Spirit...even as "He" would later manifest upon Jesus in thye form of a dove lighting down from Heaven.

Rashi says that the Shekinah speaks...in the Hebrew; and the Rabbis concur in their conclusions that, well, he simply meant 'G-D'.  So if the Shekinah speaks, and Rashi isn't banned by the Rabbis for saying thus...what else about this Voice does Rashi say, so as to infer "personhood" upon what might otherwise have been written off as  Semantics in the English translations?    

The Holy Spirit blew forth as a wind to express His Presence and give strength and vigor to Israel, and parted the Red Sea. And at the proper time, the Right Hand did cover their enemies in that same sea.

 The Holy Spirit blew forth and brought the pheasants by the hundreds of millions to Israel.  And the Holy Spirit was hovering at the Beginning over the face of the deep, and moved upon the faces of the waters.

Whenever there was life brought forth, both the pre-Incarnate Jesus (the Word) and the Holy Spirit (Wisdom) was there.  If life wasn't brought forth, such as when YHVeH Yeshua spoke from the whirlwind unto Job, we needn't expect some sign of the Spirit's presence. 

When YHVeH the Son did a likewise whirlwind to Ezekiel as He had done to Job...that prophet, Ezekiel,  became indwelt by the person of the Holy Spirit in the same way we New Testament believers have become indwelt by G-D.  

In the New Testament, we simply see revealed what was in the Old Testament just somewhat concealed.  As we move from Torah to Writings to Prophets in the Tanach, we see this pattern of unfolding insights, revelations, and happenings  consistently supporting the New Testament through many legal and prophetical precedents.

But in the end, as Revelation 19:10c informs to this effect, that the testimony of Jesus is the spirit / true-intent of Bible prophecy.  Our focus is ever on Him, and the revelaltion of Him in our hearts, minds, and lives -- unto eternity.  Shalom.
#8
Deuteronomy 13:18

...thou shalt hearken to the VOICE of YHVeH thy G-D...to do that which is right in the eyes of YHVeH thy G-D.

I want you to begin looking at this after the manner that we call "the Angel of YHVeH" as the G-D of Israel...so are we to call "the VOICE of YHVeH" as the G-D of Israel.  

Ask yourself, what is really the difference in the wording here?  Malak is used for angel and messenger.  Qol is used for Voice and sound.  The entire verse of Deuteronony 13:18 reads:

When thou shalt hearken to the VOICE of YHVeH thy G-D, to keep all his commandments which I command thee this day, to do that which is right in the eyes of YHVeH thy G-D.

Notice that the Qol / Voice in the issuing of the commands and commandments:  is audible, it is intelligent, it is reasoning.  Now take the use of the Greek word "logos", "the (intelligent) word" and "reason(ing)".

In Genesis 3:8, Adam and Eve hear the person of the G-Dhead known as "the Word".  After being called YHVeH Elohim in Genesis chapter 2, we next see Him being called "the Voice of YHVeH" thousands of years before He revealed Himself as the Angel of YHVeH to Moses.

If we approach it in this context...then the prophecy of the seed of a virgin holds just as much weight as any and all 613 commandments given at Sinai.  The prophecy about the virgin birth never diminishes the coming "Instruction" or "Law" of Moses.  neither should any rabbinic sage erroneously turn around and take away from the visitation of G-D in the Garden in Genesis 3.  

I think the great error of rabbinic thinking for the past 1800 plus years has been that the visitation at Sinai was a greater event and of greater prophetical significance (etc.) than the events in Genesis 2 and 3.  

Because of this, even today, when contending over Torah, some rabbinics (de facto through the reasoning of their arguments) in their zeal, will declare Sinai greater than the promises of G-D given to Abraham....  Yikes!  

Those taking such a position, force themselves to where a decision has to be made that the prophecy of inheriting the Land of Israel is picked and chosen, but other prophecies of Abraham and others (especially those NOT dealing with the land rights to Israel), are essentially sidelined as virtually irrelevant or simply as passe'.

And oddly enough, it appears as if Genesis marks for the Rabbinic, the "Jewish Old Testament", the books of Exodus to Deuteronomy as "the Jewish New Testament"....and to them, that must make the rest of the Tanach as but some form of inspired "Commentary", subservient to self-puffing Rabbinic Commentators within Mishna / Gemara / Talmud.  
What an odd thought process.


In other words, G-D's "thus saith YHVeH" is made subservient to some ancient fad popular or politically correct rabbi, who followed long long after, whose words are "worshipped" as greater than that of the Almighty.  Man is deified over G-D, and worshipped and valued over G-D; 'but don't you dare convict us "rabbis' or "rabbinics" of our hypocrisy and make us feel bad about it.'  If you do, you are an anti-Semite!  To be Jewish you must practice idolatry, blasphemy, and various social levels of self-deification over G-D?   What a very odd thought process they have.  

Food for thought.  Shalom.
#9
The Lesson from Haggai:  

The emphasis of our life in service to the L-RD is found in obeying the VOICE of YHVeH through faith (1:12), and NOT through trusting what works of the hands we do as to our righteousness in Him (2:14).

Chapter 1:
12 Then Zerubbabel the son of Shealtiel, and Joshua the son of Josedech, the high priest, with all the remnant of the people, obeyed the VOICE of the LORD their God, and the words of Haggai the prophet, as the LORD their God had sent him, and the people did fear before the LORD.  (KJV)


VOICE [Qaf - Vav - Lamed] is spelled here (in the Hebrew) the same as in the quotes in Torah I have cited in conjunction with the VOICE of YHVeH as being equivocal to saying "the Angel of YHVeH...both being names for "G-D" after a descriptive no different than El Shaddai (G-D Almighty), and El Roi (G-D who sees all).  


Chapter 2:
14 Then answered Haggai, and said, So is this people, and so is this nation before me, saith the LORD; and so is every work of their hands; and that which they offer there is unclean.  (KJV)


14. And Haggai replied and said, "So is this people, and so is this nation before Me, says the Lord; and so is all the work of their hands, and whatever they sacrifice there is contaminated.  (Judaica Press)



Rashi comments:
So is this people Just as you err in this, so do you err in many halachot.  

[Rashi repeated for the Gentile understanding:] Just as you err in this, so do you err in the ritual law keepings of many laws.

[In other words, Rashi is again just at the brink of getting it, but doesn't quite make the mark.  But notice how he affirms the thesis of Paul's arguments in Romans, and leans toward the fact that it is Faith and not works of the Law that holds redemptive power towards righteousness in Him.  The same VOICE who spake to Adam in the Garden, spake to and led the remnant of Israel through the prophet Haggai (1:3, 13-14) only 3 months earlier.]

and whatever they will sacrifice there if they do not put their hearts to learning.

[That is, the application of faith / trust, the application of the heart in a right "faithing" and the right retention and practice of that "faithing / trusting" triumphs over the works of doing this and not doing that.]
#10
Brianroy Wrote:In Genesis 3:8,
    "They heard the VOICE of HASHEM G-D walking in the Garden toward the direction of the sun; and the man and his wife hid...."

Rashi comments:
"They heard...I have come for nothing but the simple meaning of Scripture and for aggadah, which resolves the words of Scripture with each word stated in its proper framework, and with its correct meaning.
        'they heard the VOICE of the Holy One', Blessed is He, 'WHO was walking in the Garden'...toward the direction of the sun ...in the tenth (hour)."

Judaism says G-D is incorporeal, and invisible...hence, unable to walk in a visible manner.  But this is refuted in Genesis 18 and many passages of Tenach.  Rashi knows this and refutes the notion.  This is why he sets the commentary of this above verse of Genesis 3:8 up in this way.

In the passage of Genesis 18:1 ff., HASHEM appears as a man...HASHEM appears as a man...HASHEM appears as a man to Abraham on the plains of Mamre.   He is called "The Holy One" by Rashi.  This HASHEM who appears as a man, is accompanied by two angels of Lot's deliverance.  

There is absolutely no doubt, over and over, that Rashi views this HASHEM at Mamre -- and His Garden appearance also -- as visible.  

Hence, Rashi himself, among the greatest of rabbinic commentators, recognizes the mystery of the VOICE of HASHEM as HASHEM in these two passages by its simple meaning and non-halikah interpretation.  

Shalom.

Any one like to add?

These men are ministers of G-d. It is a clue in understnding the burning
bush.


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