Bible Options Bible Study Software
Thread Rating:
  • 1 Vote(s) - 4 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
The "Shema", Deut 6:4, and the Absolute One G-d
#21
(12-15-2013, 08:19 AM)Azriel Wrote: The 2nd.Jesus is not G-D Omnipotent , but a new man, new Creation likened to Adam retaining the fulfilled knowledge of good and evil ,who by innocence [without sin ] retains the inflowing of Hashems Spirit. Jesus will is his own, choosing by free will His own will to be Hashems Will.
Luke 22:42 Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but yours, be done.
I agree with this understanding, but not necessarily the details, i.e., sinless.
#22
(12-15-2013, 11:00 AM)Nachshon Wrote:
(12-15-2013, 08:19 AM)Azriel Wrote: The 2nd.Jesus is not G-D Omnipotent , but a new man, new Creation likened to Adam retaining the fulfilled knowledge of good and evil ,who by innocence [without sin ] retains the inflowing of Hashems Spirit. Jesus will is his own, choosing by free will His own will to be Hashems Will.
Luke 22:42 Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but yours, be done.
I agree with this understanding, but not necessarily the details, i.e., sinless.

Azriel, Jesus is GOD Omnipotent and He is also a man. He is the God of Moses. You speak as if you don't know Him. You better seek His Face.
2 Corinthians 4:6
For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Acts 2:25
For David says concerning Him: ‘I foresaw the LORD always before my face, For He is at my right hand, that I may not be shaken.

AND SO DO I, YESHUA IS ALMIGHTY GOD
#23
(12-15-2013, 06:36 PM)Tanachreader Wrote:
(12-15-2013, 11:00 AM)Nachshon Wrote:
(12-15-2013, 08:19 AM)Azriel Wrote: The 2nd.Jesus is not G-D Omnipotent , but a new man, new Creation likened to Adam retaining the fulfilled knowledge of good and evil ,who by innocence [without sin ] retains the inflowing of Hashems Spirit. Jesus will is his own, choosing by free will His own will to be Hashems Will.
Luke 22:42 Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but yours, be done.
I agree with this understanding, but not necessarily the details, i.e., sinless.

Azriel, Jesus is GOD Omnipotent and He is also a man. He is the God of Moses. You speak as if you don't know Him. You better seek His Face.
2 Corinthians 4:6
For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Acts 2:25
For David says concerning Him: ‘I foresaw the LORD always before my face, For He is at my right hand, that I may not be shaken.

AND SO DO I, YESHUA IS ALMIGHTY GOD
Nope, Azriel has the right notion. Mal 2:10. There is only one G-d, and one Father. There is no confusing what echad means in this verse.

Your trinity is a contradiction because at any time J-sus is equal to the father, and is the father. So, this thinking is contradicted above since the trinity teaches that you have 3 fathers, 3 spirits, and 3 sons, at any one time since they are equal in essence.
#24
(12-15-2013, 06:42 PM)Nachshon Wrote:
(12-15-2013, 06:36 PM)Tanachreader Wrote:
(12-15-2013, 11:00 AM)Nachshon Wrote:
(12-15-2013, 08:19 AM)Azriel Wrote: The 2nd.Jesus is not G-D Omnipotent , but a new man, new Creation likened to Adam retaining the fulfilled knowledge of good and evil ,who by innocence [without sin ] retains the inflowing of Hashems Spirit. Jesus will is his own, choosing by free will His own will to be Hashems Will.
Luke 22:42 Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but yours, be done.
I agree with this understanding, but not necessarily the details, i.e., sinless.


Azriel, Jesus is GOD Omnipotent and He is also a man. He is the God of Moses. You speak as if you don't know Him. You better seek His Face.
2 Corinthians 4:6
For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Acts 2:25
For David says concerning Him: ‘I foresaw the LORD always before my face, For He is at my right hand, that I may not be shaken.

AND SO DO I, YESHUA IS ALMIGHTY GOD
Nope, Azriel has the right notion. Mal 2:10. There is only one G-d, and one Father. There is no confusing what echad means in this verse.

Your trinity is a contradiction because at any time J-sus is equal to the father, and is the father. So, this thinking is contradicted above since the trinity teaches that you have 3 fathers, 3 spirits, and 3 sons, at any one time since they are equal in essence.
Re:19:6: And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

Re:19:16: And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Isa:9:6: For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

You quote Mal:2:10
John:10:30: I and my Father are one.

You reject this and the Baptist.
I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me. Malachi 3:1 Matthew 11:10-15
#25
(12-16-2013, 07:37 AM)Tanachreader Wrote: Re:19:6: And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

Re:19:16: And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Isa:9:6: For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

You quote Mal:2:10
John:10:30: I and my Father are one.

You reject this and the Baptist.
I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me. Malachi 3:1 Matthew 11:10-15
It's funny how you do not respond to my criticisms directly. The reference to Revelations answers nothing, read the thread "Yeshua and Isa 9:6(5), and you cannot be one if you are different places at the same time. So, John 10:30 refers to J-sus belief that he was following Hashem's will, Amos 3:3 (uses the root of "yachid" for together).

John the Baptist might have had good intentions, but I don't think he was a prophet.
#26
(12-16-2013, 07:37 AM)Tanachreader Wrote: Azriel, Jesus is GOD Omnipotent and He is also a man. He is the God of Moses. You speak as if you don't know Him. You better seek His Face.
Nachshon says; Nope, Azriel has the right notion. Mal 2:10. There is only one G-d, and one Father. There is no confusing what echad means in this verse.
One day the veil shall be lifted as well from the gentiles eye's and their fulfillment shall open the door of Israel's sight, and they shall know; Our G-D is One G-D.
Blessings, and understanding to all of you!

Jesus is called the Son over 200 times throughout the N.T. The Father is referred to as distinct from the Son over 200 times. Over 50 times Jesus the Son and the Father are mentioned in the same verse. Yet we find Paul’s greeting as grace and peace from both YHVH the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. Jesus identifies himself as the Son of G-D throughout the Bible. He is always put on equal status with the Father being able to bestow grace to the believer. The only time he is not equal is by position, never in nature.It is by the Fathers Will Yeshua is given Power to forgive sin; In His Father's Name.

John 20:31 ...That Jesus is the Christ the Son of G-D." Jn.16:3 "And these things they will do to you because they have not known the Father nor me." Here he is distinguishing himself as another from the Father. Yeshua separates himself from the Father in person but not in nature.

Jn.10:30: " I and my father are one" is not a numerical one, Jesus is not saying he is the father. they are not one person but in nature they are united . It actually reads we are one in Greek the first person plural esmen . Examining his claim further "I and my Father are one." The Jews pick up stones because they understood this as blasphemy in vs. 36 Jesus interprets what he meant by saying because I said, "I am the Son of G-D." There is a very good reason for this because…. Contrary to those who claim the Son of G-D means less than G-D it actually affirmed his position.

In Jn.20:17 Jesus said "I am ascending to my Father and your Father to my G-D and your G-D." . Yeshua is the servant [Isaiah 53] and as a man he was submissive to the Father as a Son. Notice he makes a distinction from "my Father and your Father" . The same is applied to " my G-D and your G-D are One G-D." As a man Jesus acknowledged the Father as "my G-D" .

I cannot say say this in the same manner as he did. G-D is his Father from eternity past, Yeshua being the Son man of the eternal generation[In Greek genos [familia [combined generations of mans knowledge of good and evil or endowing the full knowledge of mans generations. Thomas bowed before Jesus saying, he is his G-D and his Lord, Jesus could not say the Father was his Lord in the way man does, yet we do not worship the vessel of man, or any vessel[ark of the Covenant, but He who dwells as One G-D within that vessel. No man may contain all of G-D, but YHVH may contain all of one man, that is Yeshua.

Jn.11:41-43 Jesus lifts his eyes toward heaven and prays, " I thank you that you heard me, and I know that you always hear me."
We see consistently Yeshua is praying toward heaven just like all the saints in the O.T.. So why pray if your G-D. Because he is dependent on YHVH in his lowered state and he is giving us the perfect example of our having a relationship with the Father.

The Son was instructed by the Father as his G-D, since he decided not to use his position independently. Jesus never referred to his Father as "our Father" in prayer together with others. Father was a term for the Jews who were in Covenant with Hashem . Jesus who being God in nature was divine and equal in all respects to God could not call God his Father as we do, being adopted children. God was his Father in a different sense than ours, in that they were united together from eternity. So he makes a distinction of "my" and "our". "

"When Jesus prayed to the Father, the Son on earth, and His Father in Heaven. this is not separation but given authority by YHVH.YHVH is within the depth's and exists everywhere, but in might and power, the Son being, given from the Father is with him, yet the Father willed that the Son should be found on the Earth,(Tetullian.) What he is explaining is that the omni-presence of G-D is everywhere yet the location of his persons are in different areas. ( Jn.11:41-42,12:28, 17:1-26)

Mt. 26:39-42 In Gethsamane he prays three times to the Father in doing his will. Why does he ask for the Father to let this cup pass if he is G-D, Isn’t this like asking himself? Yeshua is asking if there be another way so he will not experience this. Yeshua has his own will, if not Yeshua is no more than angels who in manifestation are formed through the Spirit of YHVH. Yeshua is firstborn man, born without sin, likened to Adam ; Meshiach. He is man, but in His will; allows Hashems Will to live within Him.
83 Yeshua said, "Adam was born from great
power and great wealth, but he was not
worthy of YHVH. For if he had been worthy, he
would not have experienced death."
87 Yeshua said, "Why do you wash the
outside of the cup? Do you not understand
that the one who made the inside also made
the outside?"

Matthew 12:48 But he replied to the man
who told him, "Who is my mother, and who
are my brothers?"
Matthew 12:49 And stretching out his hand
toward his disciples, he said, "Here are my
mother and my brothers!
Matthew 12:50 For whoever does the will
of my Father in heaven is my brother, and
sister, and mother."
106 Yeshua said, "Whoever drinks from my
mouth will become like me, and I myself
shall become that person, and the hidden
things will be revealed to that person."

I do not demean the deity of Yeshua. Through Him lies the salvation for all mankind, given from His Father, Yeshua is the Meshiach of Israel given Authority from YHVH; He has risen above death , by the Hand of Almighty YHVH to give salvation to all men, as He in Heaven. but to say Jesus is G-D Omnipotent, harbors close to blasphemy, rather ignorance.
Without choice, and free will Jesus becomes a puppet in the form as a man. Jesus is a new man ,fulfilled man,without sin but within Him communes the Spirit of the Father; Our Holy G-D of Israel; Yeshua is the Prince of Peace, and Lion of Judah; One day there will be no division, and we shall be one body and one mind, of One Spirit. We cannot judge a brothers salvation else that judgment be rendered back upon us.

When I will look upon Jesus face to face one day soon, I will know see the Lord G-D YHVH who dwells within Yahoshua
Hebrews 2:9

But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honor; that he by the grace of G-D should taste death for every man.

Jesus did not make Jesus; YHVH made Jesus, else He is not man, or Meshiach.
There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots.
The Spirit of the Lord shall rest upon Him, the Spirit of wisdom and understanding, the Spirit of counsel and might, the Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord.


Yeshua is Meshiach
Shema Yisrael!
#27
(12-16-2013, 09:20 AM)Azriel Wrote: I do not demean the deity of Yeshua. Through Him lies the salvation for all mankind, given from His Father, Yeshua is the Meshiach of Israel given Authority from YHVH; He has risen above death , by the Hand of Almighty YHVH to give salvation to all men, as He in Heaven. but to say Jesus is G-D Omnipotent, harbors close to blasphemy, rather ignorance.
Sorry, Azriel. Just when I thought we are making progress towards understanding, you throw a curve ball. Yeshua is not a deity, but just a man.
#28
To Azriel I believe John the Apostle
Re:19:6: And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.
"The Lord God omnipotent,", is referring to the Lord Jesus Christ our Savior. Revelation 19:6
Jesus Christ is, Himself, the eternal God. He is not a God, or one like unto God, or a creature of God. He is God manifest in the flesh (I Tim. 3:16; Col. 2:9; Rom. 9:5; I Tim. 6:14-16). I'm a trinitarian. We worship one God in the trinity of his sacred persons (I John 5:7). We worship, trust, and love the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
Our God, Jesus Christ, is omnipotent! He has all power. Therefore, he is able to do whatever he is pleased to do in all things. And he always does exactly that which pleases him (Psa. 115:3; 135:6; Isa. 46:9-11). Omnipotence is essential to divinity.
This is our great King, Jesus Christ, "the Lord God omnipotent." We rejoice in him. He is God. He is man. He is the omnipotent God-Man, in whom we safely trust.
Isaiah 48:16

To Nachshon your a lost puppy not believing John the Baptist and Jesus.
#29
(12-16-2013, 10:52 AM)Tanachreader Wrote: To Nachshon your a lost puppy not believing John the Baptist and Jesus.
I like puppies Smile By the way, can you please explain why Hashem refers to Himself as a singular person/entity, 1 Kings 18:39, Deut 4:35?

How about why Hashem uses personal pronouns like "I", "Me", "My", "Mine", which are singular? Why not use a plural pronoun (Us, We, Our, etc.) since you think "He" is "We/Us"?

Why do we find that Hashem says in Ex 3:6,16, I am, which is in the singular? It would have been easy to say "We are".

The demons in Mark 5:9, Luke 8:30, say they have a common name (one name) though they are many. Why can't you find this type of support for your notion of the trinity in Tanakh?
#30
(12-16-2013, 11:26 AM)Nachshon Wrote:
(12-16-2013, 10:52 AM)Tanachreader Wrote: To Nachshon your a lost puppy not believing John the Baptist and Jesus.
I like puppies Smile By the way, can you please explain why Hashem refers to Himself as a singular person/entity, 1 Kings 18:39, Deut 4:35?

How about why Hashem uses personal pronouns like "I", "Me", "My", "Mine", which are singular? Why not use a plural pronoun (Us, We, Our, etc.) since you think "He" is "We/Us"?

Why do we find that Hashem says in Ex 3:6,16, I am, which is in the singular? It would have been easy to say "We are".

The demons in Mark 5:9, Luke 8:30, say they have a common name (one name) though they are many. Why can't you find this type of support for your notion of the trinity in Tanakh?

No big deal to me. The Father has said to me "I AM" and so has the Lord Yeshua said to me "I AM".


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)